Of Montreal
The relationship between Shake and OOP definitely takes a leap into intimacy in sonnets 20, 36, and 55. In 20, "the master-mistress of my passion," and "steal's men's eyes," are used to describe OOP. In 36, "Our undivided loves are one." Shake's language changes from that of giving advice. Now the Shake seems in utter admiration and has a personal tone so deeply drawn to his OOP.
Personally, I would consider what is being said way beyond the depths of anyone outside of the relationship of the two. 154 poems over 13 years (according to our books) is something too deep to understand through reading alone. One would have to know Shake to find out what he really believes/feels. Thus, I present the Of Montreal theory.
Of Montreal is a popular band currently around whose frontman uses alternate personalities to create a musical and performance experience, including that of a homosexual even though he doesn't consider himself to be. Shake was an artist. He wrote plays that were based in fiction. Why wouldn't he be able to create a series of poems by a fictional or real man OR woman towards a fictional or real man or woman. There is nothing solid to go off of, from my point of view, to declare who the author or OOP is, therefore all I can look into is the fact that Shake did write these, and whether or not the story is real, the concepts and ideas certainly are worthy of consideration.
Ryan K Bishop
the rub
Of course, as the teacher, I utterly reject this notion. :-)
However, beyond my desire not to believe it, I think we have to look at what it is that people tend to write about, and it tends to be what they know, or what they learn by doing research. I think we can rule out the research angle for the sonnets. Prose writers research, not so much poets.
What really undermines the idea though is that the poems are dedicated to someone real, maybe the OOP, maybe not at a time when poems were generally not given to the fictitious. Certainly it can all be metaphorical, but the metaphors we see tend to put the day-to-day into more poetic language and notions. So, I'm going to hold fast to the curmudgeonly notion that these poems are written to a specific person, indicating what they appear to indicate on the surface. And, for the record, there is a historical basis for Hamlet. It's found in The History of the Danes. Shakespeare tweaks it but doesn't do all that much inventing. In fact, though I don't know this for certain, I'd say most, if not nearly all, are adaptations of earlier works rather than outright creations of his own. That doesn't undermine the greatness of them by any means though. Bradley
Bradley
i agree
Since I am working from such limited knowledge on Shakespeare, I know I can't say that this is a valid theory from a research-perspective. For me, I felt like reading 20, 36, and 55 totally called out my pre-judging notions from the procreation sonnets that this was a mentor-mentee relationship. As a correct history of what this relationship actually was, I think I needed to break down preconceived notions of what a homosexual relationship looks like, what an Elizabethan-era relationship looks like, and even what Shakespeare's relationships look like. I read so much of myself into his writing, that HIS personal thoughts are going to become misconstrued and altered into something they aren't. This theory served me by my admission that I have no idea and so I will try not to read too far into anything that isn't guaranteed to exist.
Well then
I am proven wrong. Not surprising. In a way I guess you could say the song about a house burning down is based in fact and tweaked. It has happened to someone. So I see what you're saying.
-Renee Ward
beg, borrow and steal
Though I can only guess and pontificate on this, my guess would be they based the song on something they saw on the news, read in the paper, or something like that. Joesph Conrad wrote his novel The Secret Agent based on a very short news clipping about an anarchist who blew himself up while planting a bomb in London. Conrad then went on to invent all the rest of the tale, filling in the gaps up until the discovery of who the bomber was. Almost always there's a grain of reality behind works of art, something that spurred the artist to create what they did. Bradley
Bradley
Same idea
I love this concept. It is not that I would have a problem with Shakespeare having homosexual relations. There are so many poets that we know beyond a shadow of a doubt loved a person of the same sex more than a spouse they had. But I love this concept because it's so different than the ideas many critics have come up with. It seems perfectly plausible that Shakespeare was exploring different worlds through fiction. We do not believe that the play Hamlet was based off of any facts. Why then should his poetry be? I love also that you tied it in to Of Montreal. Your entire theory reminds me of a song I love by Company of Thieves in which a house burns down and the main character deals with the aftermath. None of the band members have had their houses burn down, but they wrote about it to signify some important event or feeling. It makes me wonder if Shakespeare could have been trying to use fiction to convey a feeling or symbolize an event. Or perhaps I am reaching too far. It works for Co. of Thieves though, and it turned into art that resonates with anyone, even if their house never burned down.
-Renee Ward
Curious Concept
I am intrigued by the theory that you have put forth and I must say that this seems like something Shakespeare was more than capable of doing. He lived in a realm of creation so why would we ignore the notion of him creating fictional characters or a fictional OOP. If anything I would almost expect it to a certain degree. I agree with you on the fact that if this were a proper relationship between two individuals it would take more than a few sonnets to understand the full spectrum of their love or even lack thereof. It is impossible to understand what would seem like simple or trivial relationships that people have, let alone try to understand how one person may perceive their relationship or the OOP. Veronica
Valid Theory
Did you just name/draft this theory, or is already widely known? Either way, I like it. Fiction writers write from viewpoints of characters, poets often do the same. Personal feelings and beliefs emerge, but I like the theory that Shakespeare had this character in his head that he slipped into to write Sonnets.
Erin Kay Schulz
Literal vs. Figurative
I think that that is a fascinating and entirely plausible theory. It is my habit to leap to literal conclusions with no room for artistic interpretation, but there is nothing to say that these poems couldn't be written about a fictional situation, be that homo or heterosexual.
Do you have a "gut-feeling" about the poems? I am curious to see others perspectives on this.
-Hilary